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As VAT cut comes in consumers come out in force, but will it be enough to kick-start the economy?



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Published Date: 02 December 2008
SHOPPERS were out in force in high streets and malls yesterday – the day the Chancellor's VAT cut came in – boosting confidence in a much-needed consumer spending surge.
It had been hoped the tax cut and retailers' discounts would encourage spending, kick-start the economy and temper the severity of the downturn.

The government has effectively gambled £12.5 billion of public money – on top of the £37 billion it spent recapitalising banks – on that scenario. Downing Street's strategy is based on getting people consuming again after the global collapse.

The fiscal stimulus package was revealed in the Pre-Budget Report last week, as the UK teeters on the brink of official recession. And yesterday, the strategy appeared to get off to a good start. Footfall in some malls was up on last year – with one reporting an all-time high.

Experts said reports indicated the Scottish economy remained resilient, despite the global downturn. Hamish Millar, the general manager of Buchanan Galleries in Glasgow, said: "The Christmas rush has well and truly started. We had a very busy weekend, especially on Saturday, as shoppers made the most of the dry weather to get started on Christmas shopping.

"A few stores had implemented the VAT reduction over the weekend, but most will be introducing the reduction from today."

A similar sentiment was found in the east. Rochelle Weir, the general manager of the St James Centre and Multrees Walk in Edinburgh, said: "Footfall is up on last year, but I don't think that's because of the VAT cut. We are up week on week. Footfall is hitting all-time highs. While the VAT cut may improve consumer confidence, I don't think it will have a massive impact."

The 2.5-point cut in the tax, to 15 per cent, was contained in the Pre-Budget Report. It was promoted as a spur to consumers to spend now and boost the economy, with measures to pay back the resultant public borrowing in years to come.

However, retailers complained it would cost them time and money at a critical time. Fiona Moriarty, of the Scottish Retail Consortium, said: "It has caused issues and problems for many retailers because of the scale of the changes required."

But she added: "The high street is very competitive at the moment. There are a large number of discounts and promotions being run by many retailers, and any footfall or upturn today is the result of the very heavy promotion, not solely because of reduction in VAT."

David Lonsdale, the assistant director of CBI Scotland, said the discounting from retailers was starting to have an impact. "There has been a lot of discounting and that message has been reinforced by the Chancellor's decision to cut VAT. That is a positive move for retailers, and shoppers are responding."

The UK government's code of practice allows retailers to pass on the VAT reduction at the till, rather than changing their prices, for two weeks, and it is thought many smaller firms will take advantage of this.

Amid the upheaval, economists have questioned how successful the VAT cut will be in boosting the economy, given that the reduction being passed on to consumers is so small. Even on big-ticket items, it is doubtful whether the savings will be big enough to get people to bring forward major purchases.

However, individual shops have introduced their own price cuts, far beyond the VAT trim. Store chains such as Debenhams, House of Fraser and Marks & Spencer have held bargain-buy days, with up to 25 per cent off everything.

Hazel Tierney, the operations manager at John Lewis in Edinburgh, said: "Our sales are growing week on week in the run-up to Christmas, and last week the division saw a 10 per cent week-on-week uplift on its sales.

"At the beginning of last week, there was an inevitable impact on trade when the VAT reduction was announced to come into effect on Monday. Sales picked up significantly towards the end of the week as customers appreciated the passing on of the 2.5 per cent benefit from the VAT reduction early."

The Edinburgh Chamber of Commerce chief executive, Ron Hewitt, said that although no-one was expecting a 2.5-point cut in VAT to suddenly encourage people to open their wallets, he did not believe the country's high streets were in "dire straits".

He said: "I don't think anyone is expecting a boom Christmas, but nor do I think it's going to be horrendous. Lots of retailers are reporting they are very healthy and footfall hasn't gone down at all. The problem is, people have been a little more reluctant to spend on big-ticket items."

He said many public-sector workers had the day off yesterday and may have spent it in the shops. And while some jobs had gone in Scotland, and the financial services sector was waiting for the axe to fall, he insisted the country's economy was still relatively resilient.

However, Dougie Adams, an economic adviser to the Ernst & Young Scottish Item Club, said it was far too early to start talking about economic recovery.

"The footfall will not tell us how much people are spending," he said. "The question is how much are people prepared to spend? They might be going to the shops, but instead of buying a present at £20, they are spending £7.

"We shouldn't get too carried away. The problem is that we have got very little hard data on consumer spending."

Tom Elliott, a global strategist with JP Morgan, said short-term attempts by retailers to cut prices before Christmas might not be enough to kick-start the economy. He said the savings made would probably be spent paying off debts, rather than on new purchases. "My gut feeling is that urge to pay off debt is going to absorb any surplus disposable income," he said.

He added that, for all the "fiscal trickery", consumers would be reluctant to spend when they saw friends or relatives joining the dole queue. If you see an empty desk at work, you stop spending and all your friends and relatives stop spending," he said. "It spreads like a cancer … if you see your friend losing their job, you fear for your own."

Related articles

At last – shops come to life





The full article contains 1077 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

Daily user,

Queensferry 02/12/2008 00:05:59
PLAIN AN EMPHATIC NO !

Yet again the government show that they've lost the plot!

Two and a half pence in the pound; who do they think they're kidding ?

People need to see extra cash in the 'pay packet.
2

Rufus T. Firefly,

02/12/2008 00:10:30
Tory lead cut as Labour faithful return to the fold

Labour has narrowed the Conservative Party's poll lead to just one point as the "Brown bounce" continues, according to a ComRes survey for The Independent.

It suggests that the measures in last week's pre-Budget report (PBR), including a new 45p-in-the-pound top rate of tax on incomes over £150,000, have proved popular among Labour's core voters.

The survey, taken between Friday and Sunday, puts the Tories on 37 per cent (down two points on last month), Labour on 36 per cent (up five points), the Liberal Democrats on 17 per cent (up one point) and other parties on 10 per cent (down four points).

The figures would give Gordon Brown an overall majority of 10 if repeated at a general election. The gap between the two main parties is the narrowest in any poll since January, when an Ipsos MORI survey put Labour one point ahead.
3

,

02/12/2008 00:19:44
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4

The Strategist,

02/12/2008 00:24:10
The value of the pound fell like a stone today as overseas investors realised that the UK economy is on its way to hell in a handbag.
5

,

02/12/2008 00:25:10
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
6

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 02/12/2008 00:33:14

It is definitely a 'buyers market' if you have the money to spend, but 2.5% is hardly going to make the "shopper's come out in droves", its just the time of year that most shop more.

2.5% won't be of much help to the poorer section of our society, such as many of the elderly, who will,..

...'Freeze to Death', because Government, has NOT addressed the problem of the 'Greedy Fuel Companies', that have pushed fuel prices, 'through the roof'

Question is WHY?

Maybe Number 10, don't like the thought of having their, electricity or gas, getting 'cut-off', or maybe it is for a more sinister plot.?

7

,

02/12/2008 00:33:55
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
8

,

02/12/2008 00:35:26
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
9

,

02/12/2008 00:35:44
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10

Huntly loon,

Aberdeenshire 02/12/2008 00:37:29
It must be the VAT cut what done it. The fact that Christmas is just three weeks away is purely coincidental.
11

the.ally ,

max. 02/12/2008 00:39:04
'Charles-skin-scale'; have ye managed tae clean oot yer pants yet?
Enough of yer nonsense; yer no good enough.

I wiped the floor wi' ye before; an' a'll do it again easy.
allymax.

Vote SNP for a Better, Fairer Independent Scotland.
12

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 02/12/2008 00:43:57

the.ally ~11,

Reverse the letters, 'PNS' = Persons Not Suitable.

But we know this, this is why Glenrothes was lost!


13

subrosa,

02/12/2008 00:44:32
Right now a Euro is £1.181 or £ = € 0.846. Was only 20 months ago the £ was worth twice that in Europe.

I feel sorry for these folks who have booked holidays for next year because they'll be surcharged beyond belief.
14

the.ally ,

max. 02/12/2008 00:44:56
'Scott', easy ma man.

nothing is certain.

Bush policy won't ride with the new admin'.

A brand new world is what we're gettin here; i'm hoping Scotland can 'max'-up its investiture.

Always, and will fight for, Scottish Nationalist.
allymax.
15

the.ally ,

max. 02/12/2008 00:47:04
'skin-scale', reverse whit ye want; yer still a complete a-whole.

16

the.ally ,

max. 02/12/2008 00:49:52
I notice 'Dufus' has focked-off?

Tell me Dufus, does the 'T' really stand for thick?
17

the.ally ,

max. 02/12/2008 00:51:00
Like I said before;

NUFF SAID!

allymax.
18

BIG EYE,

Paisley 02/12/2008 00:56:34
Going to stop this please?

If going out shopping suddenly translates everyone into supporters of the discredited Chancellor then we will be looking at empty streets, Christmas or not!

Rufus before you explode with excitement over the ComRES poll suggest you read about Comres polls at political betting.com. they are highly unreliable and they are not members of the accredited polling organisations for the reason of their poor methodology.

They were responsible for the Glasgow East poll that gave Labour the huge lead as a recent example.
19

,

02/12/2008 00:56:45
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
20

the.ally ,

02/12/2008 01:15:01
'Hi Scott', maybe, but I don't see it that way.

He's put in place a well documented and well rehearsed 'fighting machine', there's no doubt about that.

But that could be just what Kennedy did also; it's called 'grandstanding'.

Not to give the game away, but I actually think the president, (and elect), would not think twice about punishing agressors.

when in Rome!
21

,

02/12/2008 01:33:20
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
22

the.ally ,

max. 02/12/2008 01:37:21
Scott, I will, but I don't expect to hear anything new.

Like i said; it's all 'politics'.

allymax.
23

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 02/12/2008 01:37:36


Children ask Soo many Questions, especially when out shopping! Don't they?

The Future is Bright the Future is not Scottish!

Child: "Mummy what happened to Scottish Oil"?

Mum: WE LOST THAT!

Child: "Mummy what happened to Scottish Banks"?

Mum: WE LOST THAT!

Child: "Mummy What happened to Scottish Heritage"?

Mum: WE LOST THAT!

Child: " Mummy What happened to Scottish Independence"?

Mum: WE LOST THAT!

Child: "Mummy is there anything we don't loose"?

Mum: YES MY CHILD!

Child: "What Mummy"

Mum: OUR FOOLISHNESS IN GIVING IT ALL AWAY!

Child: "is there anything we do have"?

Mum: YES MY CHILD!

Child: "What Mummy"?

Mum: A VERY NICE LOVING POLISH COMMUNITY, WHO APPRECIATE SCOTLAND, AND WILL MAKE IT A BETTER PLACE TO STAY IN!

Child: "Gosh Mummy, do the Polish People have 'Flags'?

Mum: YES MY CHILD!, LOOK UP AT EDINBURGH CASTLE, WHAT DO YOU SEE!

Child: "Gosh Mummy, Can Santa bring me a 'Polish Flag' for Christmas"?

Mum: I AM SURE HE WILL MY CHILD!!

24

KampungHighlander,

Jakarta 02/12/2008 02:46:50
"SHOPPERS were out in force in high streets and malls yesterday – the day the Chancellor's VAT cut came in – boosting confidence in a much-needed consumer spending surge."

Though the Scotsman loves to give credit for people shopping to a miserly 2.5% cut in VAT, this shopping spree happens every year, it called Christmas.

25

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 02/12/2008 02:50:06


KampungHighlander ~24,

'YOU SAID IT'!



26

Phil C,

02/12/2008 04:09:09
We're rich! Rich beyond our wildest dreams! Oh thank you Gordon for your wonderous generosity. What utter drivel. The man robs us blind, rapes the economy, destroys the housing market, borrows £billions from us to give us back pennies; and the people of Britain flock back to Liebour, flock back to the shops. Labour voters tend to be sheep, but this is ridiculous!

"SHOPPERS were out in force in high streets and malls yesterday – the day the Chancellor's VAT cut came in – boosting confidence in a much-needed consumer spending surge." - Not in Perth, they weren't! It was deathly quiet.

This is an appallingly biased take on the situation by the Scotsman and a totally accurate one by #24 Kampung. Thank goodness Darling thought of promoting Christmas as a commercial spending spree!


27

yockel,

02/12/2008 06:04:30
John Lewis sales down 20% on the week, now that's what I call flocking to a kick start.
28

viking nz,

new zealand 02/12/2008 06:52:21
No comment your a joke labour , please rush and spend your pennies for the sake of the economy, ha ha ha .bah humbug
29

SouthernSkye,

02/12/2008 07:21:17
subrosa
..."Right now a Euro is £1.181 or £ = € 0.846. Was only 20 months ago the £ was worth twice that in Europe...."

I don't recall it being twice that. In the past 4 years of being paid in Euros the rate seemed to float around €1 = 66 pence sterling for most of the time. That is not to say that it has not plummeted. €1 = 85 pence sterling is quite a change. It would be great for UK exporters.....if we exported anything ;-) !
30

Louis Catorze,

02/12/2008 07:38:13
"SHOPPERS were out in force in high streets and malls yesterday..."

I would have to loved to join them.

Unfortunately I was working.
31

M.T.,

02/12/2008 07:53:40
30#
A friend was also working overtime putting on labels on almost six thousand stock items in the local jewellers. The labels work in conjunction with stock checks and security. Each label cost 50p.

What business, small, medium or large, can afford this extra cost, at such short notice?
32

The Glasgow Ranger,

Edinburgh. 02/12/2008 07:58:55
If your job was at risk or if your employer was finding trading conditions difficult would you rush out to take advantage of the 2.5% VAT reduction?
33

eric,

Lothian 02/12/2008 08:00:33
Fortunatly i was working.Ill be spending all my money in Glasgow from next wknd .as i do every year with family.as i have been doing for past 30yrs.
34

FedUpTaxPayer,

Edinburgh 02/12/2008 08:15:47
No, of course it will not. It's yet another futile gesture by the party of the economically incompetent.

Who's going to rush out and buy another bar of chocolate as it's a penny cheaper? Or even for say saving a tenner on a £500 TV. You'd welcome the saving but it would make you decide to buy.

If you fear you're going to lose your job you'll be cutting all spending as best you can.

The area to help, imho, is business. By helping business to survive, you reduce the fear of people losing their job and therefore I think that would help more.

Businesses need help getting finance - loans needing refinanced but simply being refused costs jobs, or being granted but at uncompetitive rates increases business costs which also costs jobs. Business lending needs to resume, at a fair, sensible level. Not reckless, but not crippling.

Darling's simply added to the already enormous bill Labour have left as their legacy.
35

AbandonAllHope,

02/12/2008 08:17:13
The only reason that Multrees gets more 'footfall' is because of people going to Poundland in the centre ! HA HA HA, all fur coat and nae knickers, thats Edinburgh !
36

Thomas1,

// 02/12/2008 08:32:20
They are not shoppers there all unemployed actors auditioning for a part in a new panorama documentary about shoplifting during a recession.
37

Highland Mist,

02/12/2008 08:34:40
2.5% has done absolutely nothing to kickstart spending. If spending is kickstarted by anything it's the real drop in retail prices and petrol and the fact that people have to buy Christmas (SALE) gifts for their family.

EMPHASISE: THE PALTRY DROP IN VAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH KICKSTARTING THE ECONOMY.

WHAT WOULD HELP: ABOLITION OF SELLER SURVEYS AND GOVERNMENT BACKED FIRST TIME BUYER MORTGAGES TO GET THE HOUSING MARKET MOVING, GET THE BUILDING INDUSTRY BACK FROM THE DEAD AND STIMULTATE MORE JOB GROWTH AND ENCOURAGE SPENDING.

It is NOT rocket science!
38

Highland Mist,

02/12/2008 08:52:46
NOVEL IDEA T KICKSTART THE ECONOMY:

Get the Banks to STOP bankrolling the UK football clubs and instead just spend the money supplying mortgages to first time buyers and facilities to small businesses! PROBLEM SOLVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!
39

jdships,

Edinburgh 02/12/2008 08:54:36
"SHOPPERS were out in force in high streets and malls yesterday – the day the Chancellor's VAT cut came in – boosting confidence in a much-needed consumer spending surge."

Yet another "non story" from the "Dynamic Duo" .
It is three weeks to Christmas , for goodness sake, and if people aren't in the shops now they never will be.
£2.50 off a £100 purchase is not going to make one whit of difference it is the 50% reductions offered by the stores that will attract.

Hope our intrepid reporters remind people that the 2.5% will have to be paid back , no doubt with interest !!
40

A Crofter,

Western Isles 02/12/2008 08:55:29
It'll soon be time for the "Airports, Stations and Motorways Busy" headline.

Must be the holy consumer festival of Xmas!

I trust the Hootsmon's intrepid pair of totty newshounds enjoyed yesterday's retail therapy.
41

Mcsnagpile,

02/12/2008 09:00:09
With the pound exchange rate knee high to a grasshopper you better buy quickly before the prices go through the roof---even with zero interest rates..
42

Gaelforce,

Hawaii via California & Dumbartonshire 02/12/2008 09:03:18
Newsflash !!!
It's officail the USA is now in a Recession, which means that Herr Broons UK is in the toilet, so much for his WORLDLY WORDS OF WISDOM, yea the Americans have certainly taken them on board ie. "In one ear and oot the other".
43

Donnie Murdo,

Western Isles 02/12/2008 09:03:36
Hmm.

Lets see. It was a holiday weekend (St Andrews day public holiday for those that were granted it) and many folks would have been paid (end of the month) and Xmas coming up.

Lets see if the momemtum continues before shouting form the roof tops that Broon is a "Moses type figure leading us to freedom"
44

An Greumach Mor,

Scotland 02/12/2008 09:09:38
That Scotsman is once again singing the song of Super Gordo and his boy Darlingman.

If you look at records going back years you will see the Christmas shopping rush kicks off immediately after a hige number of people get paid at the end of November. This year it was over the weekend for most of the public services and a large percentage of businesses.

Total non story by non jouralists. Labour Propaganda and Drivel.
45

subrosa,

02/12/2008 09:29:32
# 29

You're quite right. Maths obviously isn't my strong point in the middle of the night.
46

Alan B,

02/12/2008 09:43:08
This will be a long and deep recession due to the sheer incompetence of Brown much worse than most other countries.
47

Liz,

Edinburgh 02/12/2008 09:47:51
#37
The housing market is only going to get moving again once prices have fallen to a more sustainable level. Do you not see that it is the recent unsustainable rise in the value of property that has lead us into this mess?!
Interest rates have been too low and the banks have lent too much money. Now that it has become obvious that they are not going to get it back suddenly we have got problems.
Gordon Brown did not see the inevitable current problems coming (despite all the warnings) which for someone known as our 'Greatest ever Chancellor' is worrying for us all.
48

yockel,

02/12/2008 09:52:14
Conserve and save the planet, spend and consume, save the economy, what are meant to do, toff a coin?


Explanation:- Apparently the Hootsmon think to throw a coin in the air is an allusion to nnasturbation.
49

salmondella,

UK 02/12/2008 09:52:15
Its going to take time and a lot of a pain. But many of my generation survived the 1980's which was just as bad. Bit of news this morning - New poll has the Tories only one point ahead of Labour. Bad news for Salmond - a Labour comeback in Scotland would kick his dreams of independence into touch, forever.
50

ploughmans lunch,

02/12/2008 10:14:42
"As VAT cut comes in consumers come out in force, but will it be enough to kick-start the economy?
No chance, this token gimmick is a farce like Broon and his inept fools in westmidden.
This pathetic piddling amount just shows how out of touch with reality Broon and his darling are.
51

nostress,

grangemouth 02/12/2008 10:18:18
Let's see now...end of month = payday for most folk...so yeah they'll be splashing their cash around for a coupla days at least...the other aspect is I reckon like most years the numpty mindset will buy lots of crud that they don't need, with money they don't have, cos "it's christmas isn't it - you gotta celebrate christmas..." - and anyway most of them don't believe things will get that bad as they've never experienced this before.
52

,

02/12/2008 10:46:05
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
53

Alan B,

02/12/2008 10:49:59
#Ananda

Gordon is dammed because he created/allowed much of this mess.

It is always difficult to sort out the mess once you are in it, much better to run the economy in a prudent manner and prevent the fundamentals of economic mgt being ignored.
54

Dr Gonzo,

02/12/2008 10:52:28
#39 it is not a 2.5% cut in prices it is a 2.5% cut in VAT. That means if your buy an item costing £100 you will now pay £100 x 3/23 = £13.04 in VAT compared to £100 x 7/47 = £14.89 before the cut a saving of £1.85.
55

Miss H,

02/12/2008 11:07:27
I was out shopping over the weekend, many shops are discounting by 20, 30 or 40% already.

Yes they have all brought in the VAT reduction but the saving you are making at the till is 75p here, £1 there. It's not going to make any real difference unless you are thinking of buying something really big. And if you are I would advise you to wait for the post Christmas sales.
56

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 02/12/2008 11:12:58

Dr Gönzo ~54,

"£1.85" thats a good saving, the cost to 'boil the kettle' :(
¿§~



57

Jwil,

02/12/2008 11:14:19
"As VAT cut comes in consumers come out in force, but will it be enough to kick-start the economy?"


Is this really cause and effect as is being suggested?
People were out shopping in large numbers anyway for Christmas, even before the VAT change took place. I can't see that a VAT reduction of this amount is making any diference.
58

Peter60,

Leith 02/12/2008 11:28:15
I noted yesterday various cafes and bars offering no price reduction at all. This means they're pocketing the VAT reduction. Might I suggest a boycott? Quick website to name and shame?
59

,

02/12/2008 11:35:19
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
60

Peter60,

02/12/2008 11:46:28
OK then, a tiny survey made by myself in Ocean Terminal, once I'd noticed what was going on, was that Boots and HMV made the reductions at the till, whereas the Ocean Cafe did not. Clearly this is entirely legal, as they'd chosen yesterday to raise all their prices ever so slightly. I'm just saying.
61

long live the supermarkets,

every little hurts 02/12/2008 11:50:09
I can see the spirit of christmas has arrived just read the treads Bah Humbug.
#58 You could start with Poundland which now should be 97and half p land.
62

Dr Gonzo,

02/12/2008 11:53:58
#61 no 98.15p land
63

Peter60,

Leith 02/12/2008 11:57:08
97.87234 p to be correct.

(You have to multiply the old price by 115/117.5)

Just think of prices falling by 2.1 percent, and you won't be far wrong.
64

Hugh Roscombe,

02/12/2008 12:06:25
62

It is more complicated than that. Poundland sells some goods that are either zero VAT rated, or reduced VAT rated. Given this, it would be more like 99.015p land.

Given the above, best to call it Poundland.
65

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 02/12/2008 12:08:07

But maybe these cafes and bars are not VAT registered you know it takes about £60,000.00 of turn-over per year to become VAT registered, thats a lot of coffee to sell,
BTW, Poundland is a brilliant shop and innovation they are packed out with customers all day long, well the seeing what people can afford.

66

TimW1234,

Ottawa, Canada 02/12/2008 12:08:26
From what hovel or cave did this neanderthal calling himself "the.ally" drag himself from - knuckles dragging, slack-jawed and drooling, stinking of self-abuse, and an utter useless and inferior example of human genetic material.

His comments are practically incomprehensible, insulting, almost obscene, and totally without relevance to the newsitems under discussion.

I think the reduction in the VAT will work for a while but it is not a long-term solution.

Now, the.ally, drag yourself back to your filthy cave and stop commenting on this thread because you are superfluous to present needs and any future needs until the end of time.
67

Hugh Roscombe,

02/12/2008 12:10:52
Wagon Wheels - 9 for £1
10pk Hula Hoops £1
Veet Hair Removal Cream £1
Air Wick solid air fresheners £1 each
2pk re-usable toastie pockets £1
USB mouse £1
Slimline reading glasses & case £1
UHU multi purpose adhesive 125ml £1

Does it get any better than this?
68

Hugh Roscombe,

02/12/2008 12:12:27
66 Tim

What's with all the flowery prose Tim? Stop beating about the bush.
69

JayDeeTee,

02/12/2008 12:16:37
#2. Rufus "It suggests that the measures in last week's pre-Budget report (PBR), including a new 45p-in-the-pound top rate of tax on incomes over £150,000, have proved popular among Labour's core voters."

Funny how the average salary of a Labour politician is about £145,000. Co-incidence or what?
70

Hugh Roscombe,

02/12/2008 12:16:39
Pink cowboy hat £1
Hawaiian Dress Up Kit £1
Pom Pom Art Kit £1

It's going to be a very merry Christmas.
71

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 02/12/2008 12:24:01

Tim ~66,

Yes you are correct, some just cant be pleasant, you should of seen what has been removed, one reason my comment @ #23, looks a little strange not relating to topic as it was relating to other comments.
Anyway Tim, its getting cold over here in Scotland and this is the first year ever in my life that the price of fuel is a worry, have a nice day Tim.

72

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 02/12/2008 12:27:57

Hue 70,

My wife wanted that "pink hat" she saw it on Sunday, it was the last one, but being a Woman, she could not make her mind up! :)

73

Fred Quimby,

02/12/2008 12:30:04
All the broohaha about 2.5% reduction in VAT.

Economic stimulus? The Parliamentary side of my @rse it is.

There are so many products, so many variations, so many marks that trying to work out which one gives value for money, either before or after the temporary reduction, is all but impossible. They have groups of boys in suits working as we speak to fog up the price tickets to their advantage.

So where is the money going that this temporary reduction gives?

Big companies, into the P & L account.

Little companies, especially the ones who need a break, into the big, bad, bank managers sticky hands are increased charges on the loans they already have or need to negotiate today to survive tomorrow?


"Cheers, trebles all round" at mega bank corporation and "thanks Gordon, we'll send you a Xmas card from our winter sun holiday spot, paid by our interim bonuses"

Brown and Darling, unfit for purpose!
74

Fred Quimby,

02/12/2008 12:38:27
#72
Charles Linskaill,
Edinburgh 02/12/2008 12:27:57

I am going to phone up ma pal, Germaine Greer, and let her set about you.

There are plenty of nifty Pink Bonnets around, some of them are quite fetching.

You should try one yourself or, better still, ask Fifi La Bonbon for some advice.

75

Luke Skywalker,

02/12/2008 13:07:48
What amuses me is that all these posters who say 2.5% is insignificant are probably the ones who squeal when it goes up by 2.5%
76

La5t_minit,

02/12/2008 13:25:56
#67

Wagon Wheels - 9 for £1
10pk Hula Hoops £1
Veet Hair Removal Cream £1
Air Wick solid air fresheners £1 each
2pk re-usable toastie pockets £1
USB mouse £1
Slimline reading glasses & case £1
UHU multi purpose adhesive 125ml £1

With that shopping list you must be a half blind, overweight, hairy, have a major BO and glue addiction issue and love toasting wagon wheels for the toasted marsh mallow effect. What you do with a £1 USB mouse is anyones guess.
77

Miss H,

02/12/2008 13:30:32
75 It is insignificant in the context of the discounts that shops are already applying.

This has been happening for the past couple of years. They start to have ‘seasonal reductions’ at the commencement of Xmas shopping. They will knock down a lot more stuff on Christmas Eve and then on Boxing Day will cut prices further.

With all that going on 2.5% off VAT is small beer.
78

MoiraMac,

02/12/2008 13:39:21
VAT! I want to know all about VAT. I’m told you can make a fortune with VAT. It seems you open a couple of shops import goods swap them about and hey presto! you’re rolling in it. It sounds too good to be true! Help please I need more details.
79

Hugh Roscombe,

02/12/2008 13:44:48
76

LOL

I posted this for the benefit of the normal posters on the Scotsman. There isn't a Poundland where I live.

(There are of course €urobazaars)

ps - no wagon wheels.
80

TimW1234,

Ottawa, Canada 02/12/2008 13:47:39
68 Hugh Roscombe

I am in a good mood this morning - it is about 9:00 a.m. here and wet snow is falling - and so was uncharacteristically reticent in my comments about that verminous slug called "the.ally".

Imagine if I was in a state of high dudgeon and became just a tad more vicious and skewered that insect with my stiletto-knifed prose?

71 Charles Linskaill

I return the compliments and hope your day is fulfilling and not fraught with nitwits such as that slimeball "the.ally".
81

Decent,

02/12/2008 14:02:48
Tim Dimwit - It's Mario of course - but then so are you and your old friend Charles.
Probably.
82

Libertarian!,

02/12/2008 14:58:48
Off all UK taxation, VAT is the most unequal and obscene of all. Why should anyone earning a certain amount over the average wage pay the same tax for ANY commodity bought; than pensioners, the low paid and those dependent on benefits?
Surely, to be seen too be just:it should be completely abolished !
83

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 02/12/2008 15:02:40
www.vouchercodes.co.uk

They will send you a top twenty of printable vouchers, usually 20/30% off, and some in some high end shops.

And off-sales.

2.5% ? Nothing.
84

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 02/12/2008 15:04:56
allymax is just misunderstood.
85

Decent,

02/12/2008 15:18:02
How come it says 101 comments and I can only see 84? Whers's the rest of them eh? Someone hiding them from me?
86

tommyboay,

02/12/2008 15:33:41
#85

About 15% discount..sound a bit niggardly to me!!!
87

Highland Mist,

02/12/2008 16:17:37
#47, Liz. The problem is nothing to do with the low rate of interest or the price of houses and everything to do with reckless and irresponsible lending of some banks to those who simply cannot afford to pay. Add to that that the situation started in the US when supply exceeded demand and outrageous teaser loans were given to the unemployed at 1/2% to the unemployed and therein lies the problem - NOTHING to do with the cost or value of property in Scotland (possibly excluding Edinburgh, St Andrews and Aberdeen) - property in Scotland is still mostly affordable, but sadly the Banks are in no position to lend to the many who CAN afford as they spent too much lending to those who CAN NOT! THAT'S THE PROBLEM!

If noone can get a mortgage it's nothing to do with any
88

Conan the Librarian™,

02/12/2008 16:49:39
85
Decent
It's the VAT discount.
89

Alan B,

02/12/2008 16:52:03
#Highland Mist

That simply is not true.

The reason the growth in personal debt happened was due to the massive house price inflation. It was an inflationary cycle.

The core problem was the failure of the government to control house price inflation. The massive inflation led to massive borrowing. The massive borrowing was unaffordable to banks by funding it using deposits. As such they competed for a share of that profitable lending by borrowing on the global credit markets.

When the US who had its own dodgy lending, caused a drying up of the credit markets the uk economy has fallen like a house of cards.

A uk economy build on excessive credit is now come home to roost.

Brown should have controlled mortgage lending and hence house price inflation. The european banks targets money supply growth ie credit and hence would have allowed the bank to use the cost of credit to control lending. Early thatcherism persued the economic philosophy monetarism behind that concept of controlling money supply to control inflation.

Personally i would rather brown had used quanititive countrols eg ratios to salary, no mortages over 100%, tighter rules on buy to let mortgages, self certs etc. Brown should also have regulated the banks to ensure capital requirements to ensure they were not too dependend on the credit markets. There are various models that could be looked at.

But no matter how you look at it it was too much lending caused by failure to control house price inflation that is the core uk economic problem. The massive personal credit means we cannot deal with the global slow down in the same way we did for the late 90s dot com crash.

Blaming banks is not really good enough as the government controls the environment, set up the regulatory environment. The government also allowed the dodgy practices used by northern rock and others where they offshored debt to avoid fsa regualations and capital requirements. We really need a full investigation into w
90

Alan B,

02/12/2008 16:53:13
... why Brown allowed this practice.
91

Conan the Librarian™,

02/12/2008 16:54:29
87
If I were a bank manager, I would give the young hip Peter Noone a mortgage.His beat combo are going places.
92

,

02/12/2008 17:26:28
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
93

Fred Quimby,

02/12/2008 17:46:41
Kenny McKellar used to be my neighbour in Lenzie.


Errrrrrrr that's it.

I'll get my coat.

Whooossssssssshhhhhh
94

SouthernSkye,

02/12/2008 18:21:06
45 subrosa,
No problemo. radio 4 news has just said €1=85.7 pence. It drops again !!
95

TimW1234,

Ottawa, Canada 02/12/2008 19:02:31
81 Decent

I fail to comprehend what you are saying.

Your posting is all disjointed, disconnected, incomprehensible.

Perhaps you need a good, long rest, dearest one, or take your medications AS PRESCRIBED!
96

Tris,

02/12/2008 19:48:12
I didn't notice that the shops were particularly busy actually. Well not for the time of year anyway. As someone pointed out, a surge in the spending could be something to do with it being Christmas and the end of the month.

If people are rushing out to spend money they can't afford because the chancellor has reduced VAT, then it says rather a lot about them.

I noticed a saving of about 17p on my spending yesterday. To save a whole pound you'd have to spend £50. To save a fiver, you're gonna have to spend £250.

But remember a fiver won't even buy a packet of fags now.

This £12.5 billion pound giveaway, wont give much to the average punter.

Anyone know what you can get for 17p?
97

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 02/12/2008 20:17:48

Tris ~96,

"Anyone know what you can get for 17p?"

S.F.A! (and that does not mean the Scottish Football Association)

However I did see some Children in our local Asian paper shop, purchasing a, what we used to call,...

....'A Penny Chew', and it cost the wee lad 10pence :)


Anyone remember in the 70s 3gallons of petrol for £1.00

.........................3gallons would now cost £13.66


98

Conan the Librarian™,

02/12/2008 20:20:51
96
Votes?
99

Conan the Librarian™,

02/12/2008 20:23:53
Hunnerbagging.
100

Yankee girl,

California 02/12/2008 22:16:03
#91 Conan.

I remember Peter Noone. Ah, the good old days.
101

Yankee girl,

California 02/12/2008 22:25:47
Regarding the article, I wish you luck with the VAT cut as an economic stimulus. Nothing we're trying over here seems to be working and I'm getting whiplash from the see-sawing stock market. Today, they announced the US is officially in a recession and has been for a year - no surprise there.
102

Buckfastleigh,

Plymouth Rocks 06/12/2008 09:37:46
Spend and all will be well!

It must be surely clear now to all that the Brown Chancellorship was an unmitigated disaster and the comment made by our friend says it all:

"There is now no shadow of a doubt that Scotland will fare much better out of the UK and fully intergrated in the EU. I trust the EU more than the political elite in Westminster who are driven by self interest and party dogma".

Why this ridiculous media putting of Brown on the "light of the World" pedestal in international finance? Is it originating from his own press releases?

Listening to some of the popular media you might believe that he has been telling the other Europeans at every stage on how to deal with the crisis; not a bit of it! But at least he has been doing what they have sensibly agreed to do.

He failed deliberately to join the € when he could have done and look at the mess we have been put in!

He must surely be punting on a General Election this spring. How irresponsible!

The VAT measure is welcomed but it all part of the face saving effort to stimulate the consumer spend. What will happen when all the money on credit has been spent and no more is forthcoming? well we will see!

Are you still going to vote for him?