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Lack of goals from midfield Celtic's major title handicap



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Published Date: 15 April 2008
BY ONE of those curious paradoxes indigenous to football, Celtic's 4-1 victory over Motherwell the other day – their highest score in more than two months – highlighted their most serious flaw, the handicap that has dimmed almost to the point of non-existence their prospects of retaining the Premier League championship.
The clue is to be found in the fact that three of the four goals were delivered by their principal strikers, Jan Vennegoor of Hesselink and Scott McDonald, and the other by the central defender, Stephen McManus.

During the immediately preceding run of one win from five matches – a sequence in which they dropped seven points to Dundee United, Rangers and Motherwell and were eliminated from the Scottish Cup by Aberdeen without scoring a single goal – it would have become obvious to anyone paying even cursory attention that, in the event of their strikers suffering a loss of productivity, there was no-one who could be relied upon to compensate.

Championship-winning teams are almost invariably served by midfield players who make a significant contribution to the goals-for column. Of Celtic's 73 league goals this season – the same number as the leaders, Rangers, despite the recent failures – only 18 have come from the four most-picked midfield players, Scott Brown, Massimo Donati, Aiden McGeady and Shunsuke Nakamura, who share a combined total of 97 appearances.

Of the 68 actually scored by Celtic players (the other five have been own goals by opponents), McDonald (21) and Vennegoor of Hesselink (13) have provided precisely half. Gordon Strachan's fondness for dwelling on the meaningfulness of statistics, it seems reasonable to assume, should surely have persuaded him by now that the seven from McGeady, the five from Nakamura and the three each from Brown and Donati represent a very poor return from players of their general abilities.

But, in conversation before Sunday's profitable trip to Fir Park, the Celtic manager refused to countenance the notion that McGeady and Nakamura should be held culpable. He insisted that they should be exonerated on the grounds that their contribution so far was virtually on a par with last season's and that McGeady, especially, had provided more "assists" than any other player in the country.

Strachan was, however, prepared to concede that the central midfield area, where Brown's 32 appearances and Donati's 20 have yielded a mere six goals and Paul Hartley's 18 (these are league games only) have failed to produce a solitary strike, could and should have done better.

Hartley's emergence as a very proficient exponent of the primarily defensive "holding" role has clearly hindered his chances of disturbing opponents' nets as regularly as he once did, but deploying him in that position should have applied almost exclusively to European matches against high-quality rivals.

There has been a case in the past three months for playing Hartley as an attacking midfielder – in preference, say, to the disappointing Donati – in domestic matches in which the opposition could be expected to be appreciably less threatening. Hearts supporters, for example, pine for the surging, often deadly Hartley who was at the hub of the Tynecastle side who won the Scottish Cup and finished runners-up in the Premier League in 2006.

For Celtic fans, the most disturbing aspect of Brown's poor scoring rate is that he has often joked with reporters about his own shortcomings as a finisher, hinting at an acceptance of his ineffectiveness in that area as a natural and, worryingly, irremediable deficiency. A player of his energy, regularly thrusting into forward areas, should be working on completing his runs in a way that would remind supporters of the comparatively prolific Stilian Petrov.

For one of his exceptional skill, McGeady, similarly, should be more productive. Playing as wide as he does, his opportunities will be limited, but he has too often been guilty of the kind of erratic finishing that does not square with his talent.

The return to form of Vennegoor of Hesselink and McDonald at Fir Park on Sunday is surely an encouraging portent for Strachan ahead of tomorrow's showdown with Rangers at Celtic Park, but it remains to be seen whether or not the resurgence will continue against rivals who have not conceded a goal in the last four Old Firm matches.

Even victory for the reigning champions, of course, may simply delay, rather than prevent, the transfer of their title to Ibrox. As things stand, Celtic could win all of their remaining fixtures, which would include two against the current leaders, and still trail by four points at the end of the campaign.

Motherwell may have been a turning point, but it is difficult to escape the conviction that it will prove to have been too little, too late.

The full article contains 798 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 14 April 2008 11:02 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Celtic FC , The Old Firm
 
1

Raskolnikov,

15/04/2008 00:14:24
So, when the strikers aren't doing the business, they are taken to task, and rightly so. But when the strikers score a barrow load of golas between them, the focus is on the lack of goals from midfield. No wonder Gordon Strachan gets exasperated at times.

Talk about twisting statistics to suit yourself. Glenn Gibbons, you are immortal.
2

Stoobing,

London 15/04/2008 00:37:20
Barry Robson. The highest scoring midfielder in Scotland for the past two seasons. Game time under Gordy - minimum.

Brown's suspension should mean Robson starting on Wednesday and then, perhaps, Celtic will offer a threat in the final third. When Brown's back, Nakamura should be stood down.

McGeady, Robson, Hartley and Brown on the right is the best midfield Gordy can muster. Nakamura can come off the bench for 20 mins if needed.
3

Stoobing,

London 15/04/2008 00:38:38
Just read the article again. Gibbons doesn't actually seem to know Robson is at Parkhead as the top scoring midfielder in Scotland for the past two seasons doesn't merit a mention. Sound journalism there.
4

Fayneant,

NZ 15/04/2008 00:49:32
1 - Rask. What Gibbons should be focussing on is the fact that WGS has relied so heavily on one player to get the goals.
Skippy has exceeded even his own expectations this season - I have always considered him a decent, if unspectacular, player - but he has really done the business for Celtic this year.
Compare his performance with that of VoH, Samaras, Riordan, Miller before joining Derby and you ahve to ask why is it that so many international class strikers fail to sparkle in the hoops.
Then again, add the general lack of return on investment from Brown, Donati, and the eternally disappointing Nakamura and it starts to look like poor management, or poor selection of players. Or both.
Compare and contrast with Rangers now - basically the same numbers of goals for as Celtic this season, yet no one single player is relied upon to do the job. Just as well since they are either rarely match fit (JCD), injured (Cousin), lazy (Boyd), or sulking (Cousin again). Yet all - and of course, Novo - have contributed across the season.
It's hard to avoid the conclusion that Smith is doing something right, while Strachan is not. He may be exasperated, but Celtic's failings this season are of his making.
5

,

15/04/2008 00:50:27
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
6

Raskolnikov,

15/04/2008 01:13:33
#4 - Fayneant - JVOH has scored 18 goals so far this season, which certainly compares very favourably with Novo (12) Darcheville (12) and Cousin (11). If JVOH has failed to sparkle, what does that say about that trio of flops, according to YOUR customary brilliant logic?

7

Fayneant,

NZ 15/04/2008 01:19:39
6 - Rasky, are you being deliberately pig-headed?

Rangers and Celtic have scored basically the same number of goals this season, yet 50% of Celtic's have come from 2 players.
Both hit a patch of bad form and the goals dry up.
Rangers have had a season where no one or 2 players have been available for a consistent run, yet we are consistently scoring goals.

See the trend?

Are you a fan of JoH? There's not many judging by the posts here recently....
8

Raskolnikov,

15/04/2008 01:31:33
Faynenat - Forget the percentage of goals from the 2 strikers. That was not my point. My point was that you called JVOH a flop and I pointed out that he had scored 18 goals this season.

Also, why should my disagreeing with you make me pig-headed? And you frequently talk to me of high-horses????
9

Fayneant,

NZ 15/04/2008 01:57:53
Rasky, my direct quote was that VoH has 'failed to sparkle' in the Celtic jersey. He is a Dutch international who has regularly been accused by Celtic supporters on these threads of being too slow, ponderous, not doing enough to justify his place.
Based on this, I have suggested that he is under achieving at Celtic. I accept that he is doing better than genuine Celtic flops such as Riordan and Miller, but he's not impressing the fans. With the possible exception of you.

Now, as for the Rangers strikers, I have stated that there have been reasons for all not getting a regular stint (re-read post 4), yet Rangers have never hit a dry spell because there are goals coming from a broad spread of players. Frankly I would rather have a handful of strikers that can mix n match than rely so heavily on two stikers. The lack of goals in the weeks preceding the last Motherwell game seems to suggest I have a point.

Rasky, I used to refer to your high horse when I thought you were being a snooty get, until I realised that it was your dry sense of humour. However some of your more recent posts have just sounded downright grumpy and - dare I say it - petulant.
I know it must be hard for you to see this Rangers team doing so well at the moment, and I admire your willingness to show up when so many likemindeds are not, but I don't want to see you let your ire poison one of the more eloquent posters - from either side of the OF divide....
10

Raskolnikov,

15/04/2008 02:00:32
We're all doomed. Doomed I say.
11

keef23,

15/04/2008 02:36:38
infamy, infamy, they all got it infamy
12

Boston John,

USA 15/04/2008 03:53:44
Good points, Fayneant, well on the mark. No-one can credibly deny that the general thrust of this article is absolutely correct. Facts are what they are: low scoring midfield players abound at Celtic just now. The key here is, I think, that Celtic have over-relied on Aiden McGeady while Nakamura is, undoubtedly, underperforming this year. Robson may well bring a goal threat currently lacking - he needs to play more and will, I expect even after Scott Brown is back. After that, no Celtic midfielder carries a goal threat. Rangers share goals around more in general and as result, deserve to be where they are (plus of course they play an excellent defensive system which works for them). As part of Celtic's back to the drawing board planning this close season, unearthing another Petrov (as King Kenny did) is essential. Still, two potent strikers await Rangers tomorrow evening, perhaps that will be all Celtic need (he pondered forlornly...).
13

Fayneant,

NZ 15/04/2008 04:17:01
12 BJ, I suspect you may well be forlorn in your pondering - especially if WGS continues to rely on high and hopefuls against a team containing 5 players that include the job description 'centre half' on their CV...
I really thought Celtic would be a greatly improved proposition this year with the acquisition of Broon, VoH and Skippy, but it just hasn't clicked into gear the way it should have. Granted, their form has been good enough (up until lately) to win the SPL most seasons, and the CL campaign was a success, but Rangers' consistency and shear bloody mindedness looks like winning out. And as always ith the OF, you may be doing well, but if the other side is doing better, your coat is on a shoogly peg.
14

Boston John,

USA 15/04/2008 04:35:20
Yes, Fayneant, you are again on the mark in your managerial reflections(is this a good day for you or what?). Against this Rangers team, who as you know I admire for their achievemnts to date, speed up front and penetration from midfield are Celtic's best hopes: we have some of the former and some of the latter, though not a whole lot of either. Henace my forlorness - my team is crying out for a Petrov. WGS may not agree as he has the practicalities of fitting JVOH into the equation. I do not think Celtic are far away from being a good team and accept the CL point you make, although we were lucky to make it through in the same way that Rangers were unlucky not to. However, I'll take any consolation that comes this season and cross fingers that WGS can pull us back together for next. I actually like the way he learns from mistakes and grows from failure. He may even retreat from route one tomorrow night...
15

Fayneant,

NZ 15/04/2008 04:40:23
As Kenny used to say, mebbe's aye, mebbe's naw....

Any chance Faddy will be at Parkhead next year?
16

Boston John,

USA 15/04/2008 04:51:46
McFadden wold actually fit the bill for either Celtic or Rangers, he'd prefer us, but I think he may be made of more ambitious stuff. He'll stay in the EPL with Birmingham - he is working under a good manager (although I can't expect Rangers fans to agree universally) and will play every game if fit. The player I'd like to see at Celtic is Lafferty from Bolton. That would allow McGeady to move inside and play just behind the front two as the aforementioned King Kenny did. I'd like to see Aiden playing in there to see if his goal tally would increase as he picks up scraps in dangerous areas. Brown and Robson would round off the midfield for me. I think Lafferty is an excellent prospect, has speed and skill on the wing but who by reports would prefer Rangers. So my reverse to you: do Rangers sign Davis and go after Lafferty?
17

Fayneant,

NZ 15/04/2008 04:59:33
I'd love to see Davis stay at Rangers, but in a more central role than he is playing now. Problem is, Rangers now have 4 players who want that position (Davis, Hemdani, Thomson and Ferguson, who still can't resist dropping back). I agree Lafferty looks like a potentially great acquisition, but the player I would really like to see at Rangers next season is Scott Brown. Can't see that happening any day soon mind...!
18

Angoos,

Baku, Azerbaijan 15/04/2008 05:14:59
I think I'm going mad this morning.
Is this thread really as sensible as it appears to be ?
Read it twice to make sure and still can't believe it !
19

Fayneant,

NZ 15/04/2008 06:14:09
18 - Angoos - Ah you're right there!

OK - Celtic are p1sh. Discuss.


That should fix it....;-)
20

viking nz,

new zealand 15/04/2008 06:18:21
F.M. has it taken you guys that long to find out or midfield dont score goals , jesus , sometimes I cant believe the things that are so obvious you need the paper to tell you the most obvious , as for jov how many a seson did big john score and how many did he put past rangers ? need I go on .To win any league goals have to come from every dept even fullbacks , dont argue over on the truth wgs has flopped big time .
21

viking nz,

new zealand 15/04/2008 06:20:41
To go where no CELTIC MANAGER has gone before MAKE IT SO / PLEASE ADD YOUR QUOTES .
22

Manila,

Makati 15/04/2008 06:46:21
Tony Mowbray should be next Celtic manager. He seems to be committed to playing the type of football the fans want (although I am not really sure I have ever seen Celtic play the so called "Celtic way". What do the fans want exactly?)

Anyway, not sure Mowbray would give up a stab at the EPL for the SPL though.

Also, as a Dundee United fan, just give us back Barry Robson, ok. You're not using him anyway.
23

Bhoy Against Bigotry,

15/04/2008 07:07:41
Everyone Congratulate Gibbons fur being such a crappy journalist but at least he keeps trying!!!

Last week what did you write? erm Celtic gonna lose title because their strikers aren't scoring.

So going by this "Awful" report, I'm guessing next week after Celtic beat Rangers, the report will read something along the lines of....

"Celtic struggling because Defenders aren't scoring their fair-share of goals!"

Next Boruc will be heckled by the media because his exploits have led to no goals!

GIRFUY

Everytime I read one of Gibbons' "BRILLIANT" stories I can't but wonder how much money he gets paid from certain shady moonbeam-like people!
24

Robbo,

Cape Town 15/04/2008 07:11:25
#22 Here here!

Why are the guys living outside Scotland prone to a reasonable debate? it gets to about 8am Uk time and the most unadulterated p!sh is talked on these threads
25

Angoos,

Baku, Azerbaijan 15/04/2008 07:20:52
#24 Robbo

I like it when everyone in the UK gets online and starts their ranting..... makes my Lunchtime a HOOT !!

#23 obviously you mistook the vinegar for milk when you poured it over your bowl of paranoia you had for breakfast this morning. If you don't like his articles (or stories as you call them) don't read them !

As for Mowbray becoming the next Celtic manager ? Would he give up the EPL for a shot at Europe every year ? Probably IMO.
26

eric,

15/04/2008 07:21:48
Are celts in Scottish cup?
27

viking nz,

new zealand 15/04/2008 07:32:41
truth hurts Im afraid , who else do we have to bounce off stuck down here ?all we have are one sided reports and vid .sorry but we have to let off steam or I will go f.m.
28

TomKhat,

Langside 15/04/2008 07:35:36
Lads,
Think you are all missin the point. The problem with the Celts at the moment is a 5"2" ginger nyaff. Get Moyes on board and gie's a decent game for **** sake!!
29

Bhoy Against Bigotry,

15/04/2008 07:38:55
Angoos like I said before it wiz Weetabix!!!

I read his articles for the same reason most people read their horoscopes, to laugh at the $#!73 they manage to come up with everyweek, maybe he's looking to get a joab at the Daily Record.

His fictional articles are therefore just stories!
30

ImBored,

Belfast 15/04/2008 08:25:44
Some simple stats from the Beebs Club Stats pages based on league goals only.

Celtic

Defence - 5
Midfield - 21
Forward - 39

Rangers

Defence - 8
Midfield - 20
Forward - 43

mmm more goals from celtic midfielders than rangers. Article is on a shoogly peg now surely.
31

Tuatha De Dannan,

15/04/2008 08:36:36
Rask and fayneant, both of you make good points,but it still does not make Glen Gibbons a journalist. If we look back to Martin O'Neil days our midfield contributed a lot more goals. The major difference was that MON was willing to be flexible with team formation. 3-5-2 with the ability to switch to 4-4-2 mid game if needed. Unfortunatelt GS seems unwilling to look at switching from 4-4-2., unless it is to pull a striker back into the middle when playing in Europe or when we played the first game at Ibrox. I have said many times on this forum if Celtic want to beat Rangers this season then they need to match them in the middle of the park in sheer numbers. Rangers have no natural width and if you look at the goal scored against us they came right through the middle.

An extra man in the middle (Hartley) would allow a selection from Brown Robson Donati McGeady Nakamura Mizuno to actually push forward withoput leaving gaps. Balde Mc Manus and O'Dea as a back 3 would at least give us some solidity with Wilson and Hinkel able to push on up and down the flanks. We might then see more goals coming from the middle of the park, especially giving tha Mc Geady could have a much more direct influence all over the park rather than just sticking to a wide role. It would also mean it was more difficult for any opposing team to "double" up on Aiden when he has the ball.

Any way looking forward to Wednesday despite the fact that my tactical advice to GS will be ignored
32

Gerry M,

15/04/2008 08:38:29
By thunder. The day before the Glasgow derby and here we have yet another attempt to destabilise Celtic after a decent performance on a ploughed field on Sunday. At least try and hide it.
33

Tuatha De Dannan,

15/04/2008 08:39:20
PS Apologies for all typo's much too early for me.. Back to work.
34

Bhoy Against Bigotry,

15/04/2008 08:44:53
I support Strachan but if getting rid of him is the only way BOBO will be back in, then GTF Strachan!!! Bobo is feared and respected, unlike those dafties caldwell and McManus!!
35

Blou,

15/04/2008 08:45:08
We know their fans major handicap. Feeble mindedness.
36

Fayneant,

NZ 15/04/2008 08:47:08
31 - I have never claimed GG was a journalist. He's a lazy fecker with a keyboard for sure.
37

Wee Pal Joe,

15/04/2008 08:48:55
"By thunder. The day before the Glasgow derby and here we have yet another attempt to destabilise Celtic after a decent performance on a ploughed field on Sunday. At least try and hide it." (32)

Yeah the article is a part of a big evil conspiracy if ever I saw one. :0)
38

ninenro,

15/04/2008 08:56:12
Should read "Lack of anything from midfield Celtic`s major title handicap" Duds the lot of them. More proof tomorrow. Ye !! Ha !!
39

Old Siggy,

Dunbar 15/04/2008 08:56:24
This is a pretty good article with one exception, although Stan Petrov was a great player he was anything but "prolific". During his 7 years at CP he scored a total of 55 league goals, an average of less than 8 per season. When Rangers turned us over in 2002-03, he didn't make double figures, Barry Ferguson on the other hand scored 16 league goals. The lack of goals from midfield added to the barrowload of missed penalties cost us the league that year. We have not had a prolific scorer in midfield since Craig Burley.
40

Tuatha De Dannan,

15/04/2008 09:05:41
39 Alan Thomson contributed a fair few as did Lubo from a midfield role
41

Exiled in Sydney,

15/04/2008 09:10:05
#39, Was that not the season petrov was coming back from his broken leg or am I a year early? I'm a gers man so not too hot on the facts for your guys.

I'm surprised he averaged only 8, he always seemed to get more than that. Good player though, did you see his goal for villa at the weekend? Hell of a strike with his left peg as well.
42

DGSEVILLE2,

Northants 15/04/2008 09:23:30
The reason Rangers have dominated this season is simply because WS has played a very conservative type of football, with experienced seasoned players at the back and midfield, and all his squad have made significant contributions in terms of goal scoring.

While WGS has made errors in persevering with out of form players, Donati and Naka, and not introducing flair players, Riordon and Robson to get the team going again.

There are no excuses, I understand Riordon's frustration, and Robson should have started more since his transfer.

This is WGS fault and unfortunately I think he is too pig-headed, like most managers, not to realize that WS has outmaneuvered him.

Well done to Rangers for taking advantage of a manager who has not acted when he needed to.
43

Ghengis McCann,

Edinburgh 15/04/2008 09:23:50
#4 - "Compare his performance with that of VoH, Samaras, Riordan, Miller before joining Derby and you ahve to ask why is it that so many international class strikers fail to sparkle in the hoops"

In Riordan's case he'd have to be given a decent run of games first. His strike rate to games (or parts of games) played is actually not bad. He was a proven goal machine at Hibs and only the Wee Ginger Minger knows why he won't give him a game. Looks as though Robson is going to suffer a similar fate as well.

Certainly feeds the paranoia of supporters of non-OF teams that the main reason why the Bigot Twins buy up our good players is to weaken the opposition. Sellick got Riordan for a song and Strachan will now neither play him nor sell him, it appears.
44

Hugh Hefner,

15/04/2008 09:26:40
39 - Stastics Siggy, Stan Petrov had a very poor first season so that skews your statistics slightly. He scored plenty of very important goals as I remember and was always a threat.

As you mentioned statistics, Barry Ferguson scored 12 of his goals as penalties that season.Not exactly free-scoring from midfield then. So, really, it's not looking so impressive is it. In fact, thats Barry Ferguson in a nutshell really.
45

Hugh Hefner,

15/04/2008 09:29:25
43 - I think its easier to come to that conclusion than it is to accept the fact that a player playing for their team, who they consider to be an excellent player gets a move to either half of the OF and he gets found out for being - not that good after all.

What do you think?
46

sonofcosmos,

glasgow 15/04/2008 09:37:52
#30 if those stats are right it sort of makes this article pointless..and i guess it makes our posts pointless as well.....i just hope we dont pay for being at least a game too late to start with hartely and robson..oh well...3 wins and we're 5 points clear at the top of the league...but i hear the media monkeys are starting to seap out the "extend the season" bandwagon..daryll king ironically said if they dont it would show scotland for the country it is ..as no league has ever been extended..if the spl were to do it for rangers then it would indeed show the sort of country scotland is.....x
47

DGSEVILLE2,

Northants 15/04/2008 09:42:08
Hugh,

As I see it Riordon has never let Celtic down when he has been given a chance, infact he has come on as sub and still scored goals for us, I don't care what he is like off the pitch, he has simply not had a chance on it. Our greatest manager Stein could manage players, even they were chancres, I simply do not understand this one especially when over the last 3 months the Celtic midfield have not delivered, and that includes McGeady.

As for Robson, he is a good player and should be an automatic choice given the current form of others and especially for an OF game.

WGS should be criticized but not sacked, even if Rangers implode and we still win the league, he must learn lessons for next season.
48

Bhoy Against Bigotry,

15/04/2008 09:42:30
Rangers offense goat 43 goals..... wait, all fae Boyd coming aff the bench??? cuz cuzin is mare a midfielder just like darkvilla and Nacho the crisp!

43 goals ma erse, obviously the journos agree that rangers only huv one striker!!!
49

Norman,

15/04/2008 10:08:56
Glenn. Try writing something a bit more less anti-Celtic why don't you? How about "Strachan's faith in his forward line proves right" and how he stuck with his team and look, they banged in 4 away goals against a good team. Nah, why not keep chipping away, as usual.

Yawn, seen it heard it, eaten my chips off it plenty times before.
50

Bhoy Against Bigotry,

15/04/2008 10:12:27
aye exactly GG's so-called articles are only guid fur holding ma chips!!!!
51

Ghengis McCann,

Edinburgh 15/04/2008 10:21:51
#45 - In short, I think you are wrong. As #47 has already pointed out, on the few occasions Riordan has been brought on for Sellick, he has done well and has scored goals (he scored a beauty from an impossible angle against his old club in his 5 minutes as a sub). It is not inconceivable that given a decent run in the team by a more generous and adventurous manager, he would do much better.

It might also be worthwhile re-establishing his partnership with Scott Brown, which was so prolific at Eater Road. You would maybe get a bit more out of that player as well, who still looks class but is underachieving compared to his ER days.

Finally I think it is a tad arrogant of any Sellick supporter to imagine that there is such a gulf in class between the current team and the rest of the SPL that a player as good as Riordan undoubtedly is would be "found out for being - not that good after all". Some of us might think the person currently being found out for being not that good after all is the Wee Ginger Minger who is picking your team.

What do you think?
52

,

15/04/2008 10:33:13
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
53

Exiled Bhoy in Fife,

Opposite the Ferry 15/04/2008 10:36:32
Its small wonder that WGS gets hacked off (pardon the pun) with the media in this country. I mean I seem to recall last season that the charge being laid against him was that his strikers were not chipping in with enough goals because the majority of them were being scored from midfielders. This season, the complaint is the strikers are scoring too many goals and the midfielders are not. I mean, frankly, does it matter??? He cannot win with some of the media in this country it seems. He could win the Champions League and some of the pressmen would find something to moan about.

Speaking as a Celtic fan I could not give a Friar Tuck who scores the goals as long as they go in - could be Boruc for all I care. Only at Celtic does who scores the goals seem to matter. Yes, I would like to see some more goals from midfield but frankly this is not the biggest issue I am concerned about my team at the moment.

I do note that Robson seems to have been ommitted from the above article. Must put that down to to memory loss from Mr Gibbons concerned. Too much drinking at the Louden Tavern me thinks. That Whisky can be a terrible thing as far as the old gray matter is concerned.

One thing. Looking at the main stories today - positive Rangers story - negative Celtic one. Is there a big game O** F*** game coming up soon per chance???? Thought so.
54

Hugh Hefner,

15/04/2008 10:42:53
51 - Simply, Riordan has to do better. Sorry, seen him play for Celtic on a few occasions and he just hasn't been cutting it. Bambi on ice was the last image that stuck with me on one occassion. Compared with McGeady, who is 4 years his junior, the difference in physique this season tells you all you need to know about who REALLY wants to play every weekfor Celtic.

Realistically, Riordan is up against either McGeady or McDonald - because he wont be putting JVOH or Samaras out the team - depending on what position a manager would play him. And that is what most people do not consider when they wonder why he doesnt get a game. Would you dump McGeady or McDonald out the team to make way for Disco Deeks?

Riordan was on the bench often enough at Easter Road because - guess what? - his manager just didn't think he offered enough overall to merit a starting place every week. And now, he hasn't upped his work rate, he's just upped the standard of competition he puts himself again. So no real surprise that he now gets less starts than he ever did.

PS - Ian Murray, you thought he was great, and even a crap rangers team begged to differ!
55

Robert Mason,

Larkhall 15/04/2008 11:37:51
Their major title handicap has been a wee ginger whinger.
56

stanton4,

15/04/2008 11:40:46
I have no idea why #52 was deleted perhaps Glenn's pal is the moderator

I get what you are saying HH but why Riordan ius a better player than macdonald and woulfd llikely score more goals than he has done given the same game time. I just donr get the ''step up'' to the old firm bit. Admitedly you have both had an unusually decent run in Europe, but that aside surely it is easier to play for REF or CFC than it is for Hibs ... you only have 1 of them to play against after all.

The obvious question is, if they are that mediocre, why did you not leave them where they were ?
57

Tellitasitis,

Ard Macha 15/04/2008 12:39:15
55 Royalty.
You may be right but - and I'm about to use Herald Spake - "I'm rattling my beads" that you're wrong.

The game on Wed has all the trappings of the Tommy Burns V Walter Smith era. The Good Guys do all the attacking and the Bad Guys take all the points.

However. Hope springs eternal and all that. Robson and Hartley will start in MF and Naka as well for better or worse. I'd give Bobo a start and play Caldwell in front of the back four and leave Skippy to confuse the Bad Guys defence on his own.

Can't agree about your young Scottish talent flourishing. Naissmith and Burke get starts rarely and Daily is no spring chicken.

Anyway on to Wed. I'm going for a Celtic win. If the Bad guys prevail I'm reaching for the razor blade!!
58

Tellitasitis,

Ard Macha. 15/04/2008 12:57:37
61.
Well. The cat had better hide if things go against us.
59

Tuatha De Dannan,

15/04/2008 12:58:02
61 I think we all know what 60 meant. Metaphorical suicide. As usual the comment is being twisted
60

DGSEVILLE2,

Northants 15/04/2008 13:02:20
61 Both supports are not angels and Celtic fans have done stupid and violent things in the recent past, but the Rangers support are top of the table when it comes to your history of pitch invasions, intimidation and murder, yes Celtic fans have been murdered by Rangers fans in Glasgow because they have been wearing Celtic colours, so shame on you to come on here and have a go at us about our fan record.

Come on Celtic we are going to win on Wednesday.
61

67 was a joke,

15/04/2008 13:22:27
64

67 was a joke wasn't it?
62

The hun that married a tim,

...still in the doghouse! 15/04/2008 13:25:04
#61 Hook line and sinker! LOL
63

Tellitasitis,

Ard Macha. 15/04/2008 13:25:25
67
We dealing in square and prime numbers only?
64

The hun that married a tim,

...still in the doghouse! 15/04/2008 13:30:12
#69 Touche Vorderman!
65

67 was a joke,

15/04/2008 13:45:11
67 is a prime all right.

A prime case of LAF.
66

Still Plays Football,

15/04/2008 13:45:44
This thread is a great example of why I find it so hard to be a Celtic supporter some times.
We have been all over the net arguing over why he have had a poor year and poor GG writes an article giving a pretty good reason why and he gets accused of Rangers bias and conspiring before a big Old Firm game. Then he gets abussed because he doesn't mention Robson, why should he? The guy might score some goals from the midfield but it ain't for us, he has only started FOUR games for us, thats not his fault but surely you can see that he (GG) was referring to the midfielders who play the most often.
Second point-Riordan.
Surely if a player is good enough to score 60 goals in three years for a "poor, wee" team, he should score at least that many for a "great, big" team...perhaps he has to get on the pitch to do it? I'm sure most people know that football isn't just, "go on the pitch for 20 minutes and score, or you are crap", confidence has a lot to do with it..and Deek has none right now.
67

67 was a joke,

15/04/2008 14:02:30
72

I feel your pain!
68

Daillyman,

15/04/2008 14:11:16
72

Cant argue with you're post. Robson at United was the top scoring midfield player in the country, WGS buys him to sit on the touchline, much the same with Deeks who banged in goals for fun at Hibs.

WGS has also played his part in helping the Gers and I thank him for that in not playing Hartley and Robson in the same midfield every week.

I hope he sticks to the same plan he has all season when we play the tick tomorrow, one thing about this Rangers side is that they can score goals away and win away in big matches.

Thank WGS from a bluenose and please stay for next season.
69

The hun that married a tim,

...still in the doghouse! 15/04/2008 14:33:27
#75 He said he fancied a square go with WGS so he was punted to the U17s to train.

WGS didn't fancy his chances because Celtic haven't had a fair contest since the inception of Scottish football.
70

Daillyman,

15/04/2008 14:54:53
76

I am sure you the GFITW will agree with you. lol
71

67 was a joke,

15/04/2008 15:03:51
I reckon a lot of these dhims are missing because the moderator thought they were being a little too bigoted and banned them.

Or maybe the penny's dropped that their team is mince after all.

C'mon Timmy where are you? It's all over by tomorrow night!

72

The hun that married a tim,

...still in the doghouse! 15/04/2008 15:21:08
#79 This village just isn't the same without the idiots is it?
73

67 was a joke,

15/04/2008 15:53:58
T I M M Y !!!!!!!!!!!

There'll be nothing left to discuss come Thursday!
74

sonofcosmos,

glasgow 15/04/2008 15:56:03
#72..if you read post #30 it might give you an idea why the journalists credibility is being called into question....
also robson has scored 2 goals in 4 games for us..so to say he hasnt scored for us damages your credibility...sorry x
75

sonofcosmos,

glasgow 15/04/2008 15:57:00
#79 #80..you guys are doing a pretty good job yourselves x
76

ninenro,

15/04/2008 15:59:03
72
Deek is a ned (non educated delinquent) !! That`s why WGS won`t play him !!
77

The hun that married a tim,

...still in the doghouse! 15/04/2008 16:03:04
#84 Top drawer put down, must remember that one.

RE Robson, let's put it another way - how much has he contributed to Celtic's season since his singing in January?

Answer? Very little. He scored in a game you were already 4 up in and also in a game you got beat 3-2 in.
78

The hun that married a tim,

...still in the doghouse! 15/04/2008 16:03:48
*Signing!!

Maybe if he had been singing since January he would have at least contributed something!
79

sonofcosmos,

glasgow 15/04/2008 16:06:43
#86
"#84 Top drawer put down, must remember that one." you show you could do worse x
we'll see how much robson contributes at the end of the season...my point was to the poster saying he hadnt scored for celtic...x
80

CALEDONIACO,

The Emerald City. 15/04/2008 16:13:36
I gave up driking Liquor and gambling 20 year's ago but I would bet my mortgage that after we beat the Honey's on Wed the cheating sob's will have the leauge extended.

I'm sure after last night's get together this has already been discreetly approved with brownose Bain, they are just waiting for the result to be posted. We win an extension approved, they win no extension.

Only in Scotland, BTW WGS might drive me back to the liquor!
81

The hun that married a tim,

...still in the doghouse! 15/04/2008 16:38:07
#89 I see now why you gave up gambling? You'd seriously bet your mortgage that Celtic will beat Rangers tomorrow?

The same Celtic that have won 2 games in the last 7? The same Celtic that haven't beaten Rangers since September 2006? The same Celtic that haven't even scored against us for over 405minutes?

NUTTER
82

sonofcosmos,

glasgow 15/04/2008 16:41:34
#91 has it been a long day.????..how many posts are you going to misread.??..regarding tomorrows game ..im always optimistic...so im right most of the time x
83

Hugh Hefner,

15/04/2008 16:46:22
91 - Listen to yourself, theres every chance that Celtic will hump your outfit tomorrow and you know it. I presume your already contemplating a...ahem...short holiday to explain your absence form the thread until next week in the event of a humiliation (more yours than your teams) on wednesday!

84

CALEDONIACO,

The Emerald City 15/04/2008 16:46:59
#89 Friend? So you hope it's extended, are you planning on loosing?

#91 No responce to cyber hard men! T@SSER.
85

The hun that married a tim,

...still in the doghouse! 15/04/2008 17:00:14
At last, the moron's are out to play!

#91 Yes Hugh, there is a chance Celtic will win, a very good one in fact. But tell me this, would you bet your mortgage on it?

Your pal said he would and that he had given up gambling. You can see why!

#94 That'll be RESPONSE. As in "your response was childish and showed you have the intellectual nous of....well...a Celtic fan".
86

Hugh Hefner,

15/04/2008 17:06:40
95 - No, i wouldnt, but he didnt actually say he'd bet his mortgage on the outcome of the game.

Anyhoo, I think you went off half-cocked, prematurely!
87

Norman,

15/04/2008 17:06:44
#66 Royalty

"I'd settle for a draw tomorrow, weve got bigger fish to fry."

Aye, and Bayern Munich have got your tiddler team to have as their supper come May!

I'm waiting on Alan Gow to display the form he showed before he joined Rangers. Carrying the net of balls to the bus, he just looks out of sorts...

88

sonofcosmos,

glasgow 15/04/2008 17:08:08
#95..looking in the mirror...???
#89 the "bet" was that if rangers are put under pressure the league will be extended....x and correcting spelling and grammar on a football messageboard makes you feel what ???
89

The hun that married a tim,

...still in the doghouse! 15/04/2008 17:10:22
#96 He did you know - reread it. Otherwise it would have read "...I would bet my mortgage that IF we beat the Honey's...".

Hugh i gave you more credit than that. Your pal
CALEDONIACO on the other hand is clearly an illerate moron so i expect that of him.
90

The hun that married a tim,

...still in the doghouse! 15/04/2008 17:12:11
#89 Last post before i go..

Nope, the bet was "..I would bet my mortgage that when we beat the Honey's..".

I don't care for typo's or grammar that much - but response spelt "r e s p o n c e"?? No excuse.
91

Daillyman,

15/04/2008 17:19:13
89

I could be wrong, or could have missed it but,

I have not read on these threads where Rangers supporters have been going on about extending the season.
92

Hugh Hefner,

15/04/2008 17:23:29
THTMAT - You're being pedantic sir!

He isn't my mate, I don't know him, though Im sure hes a nice enough laddie. You have to realise that a man of my gravitas doesn't hunt in a pack. I'm a lone wolf who packs a big punch and a big ego;-)
93

Daillyman,

15/04/2008 17:31:23
102 HH

Stop it Hugh we wont sleep at night knowing you hunt alone. lol
94

Daillyman,

15/04/2008 17:35:12
With pressure on both sides tomorrow, the tic to close the gap and the Gers not to lose any ground. I am looking at a 1-1 draw.
95

Tuatha De Dannan,

15/04/2008 17:50:46
Not one for predictions but a first half goal for Celtic tomorrow is a must. Then Rangers need to change their defensive formation and the game will hopefully open up. If they score first the fat lady will be singing.
96

jerrymanders,

15/04/2008 18:37:28
#105

"If they score first the fat lady will be singing."

JCD?